Author Topic: Large file  (Read 1623 times)

kchoekstra

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Re: Large file
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2018, 07:36:46 AM »
Spectacular. Nice job. Our first Compaq, 20meg ahrd drive, 1986 D-Cad 5-1/4" floppies. The file sizes are amazing. Congratulations.

    KC.

Pearco

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Re: Large file
« Reply #16 on: October 03, 2018, 09:05:41 AM »
DRPR:

Very very very nice.
My hat is off to you.
Jim
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Dempsey

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Re: Large file
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2018, 09:59:42 AM »
Phil,

Congratulations. She is a beauty!

On average 560 entities or 4,317 points per day !!!

Yes, you deserve a day off  ;D
Dempsey

Dr PR

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Re: Large file
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2018, 11:15:10 AM »
Dempsey,

I hadn't thought if it that way! 560 entities per day, for 14 years!

I'm not certain what a DesignCAD entity is. Individual lines, curves, etc. do seem to be entities. But are solids single entities or collections of entities? What about grids?

In any case, it is somewhat mind boggling to think of averaging 560 of anything per day, especially since most of the days in those 14 years I wasn't working on the model. There were periods of several months at a time when I did no actual work on the model, but when I was occupied with other things, such as working in my business, managing several web pages, researching the model or just hiking/back packing around Oregon.

On those days I was working on the model I must have been churning out several thousand entities per day!

****

Being curious about entities and points, I started with a blank drawing with no entities or points, and deleted everything except the specific object I was working on (all template lines were deleted after creating the grids). Here is what I discovered:

a line - 1 entity and 4 points.
a curve - 1 entity and 5 points
a plane - 1 entity and 7 points
a grid - 3 entities and 8 points (a grid stretched over two straight lines with one plane per line and no intermediate breaks)
a grid - 6 entities and 45 points (a grid stretched over three curves, with six planes per line and one intermediate break)
a cube - 5 entities and 28 points
a cylinder - 20 entities and 106 points (12 facets)

****

Well there are a lot of cylinders and grids in the model, so I guess it is easy to see how I racked up lots of entities and points.

Phil
DesignCAD user since 1987

Lar

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Re: Large file
« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2018, 01:24:38 PM »
Beautiful work, Phil. Amazing.

ALI ZAIDI

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Re: Large file
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2018, 02:11:09 AM »
Fantastic Work  :)
Ali Zaidi
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IMSI Technologies

Dr PR

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Re: Large file
« Reply #21 on: December 09, 2018, 10:56:32 PM »
I have discovered another problem with large files. My intention has been to use the 3D model to create 2D drawings for the real 1:96 model. To do this I want to save the 3D files as 2D projection files, with hidden line removal. I will not use the hidden line clean up option because experience has shown that it is too aggressive and removes some lines that should be visible.

I started with the 312 Mbyte forward superstructure file. After starting the 2D projection file save it appeared nothing was happening. After several hours the program indicated it was 1% done! A few more hours (over night) and it was about 8% done. At that rate it would take 8.3 days to save the file!

I aborted and restarted the program. This time I just saved a projection of the forward radar tower - part of the forward superstructure. After 12 hours the 58 Mbyte forward tower produced a 93 Mbyte 2D projection file!

I started the forward superstructure 2D projection file save again, but this time without the forward tower or any of the cambered decks - the deck grids would produce bazillions of line segments. Now, after about 48 hours, it is 40% complete. So it will take about 5 days to complete - for each view.

I need starboard, port, front, rear and top views for most drawings - about a months worth of running time. And then I have to manually clean up each file to get rid of all the little bits that the program misses (grids really make a mess) and add the few lines that the program lost.

This may take another 14 years!

Phil
DesignCAD user since 1987

adriank

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Re: Large file
« Reply #22 on: December 10, 2018, 02:11:30 AM »
Hi Phil,
Over the years I've tried many times to get meaningful 2D elevations from hidden-line 2D projections of 3D files, and while it works much better than it used to I still find the results too damaged to use.
I would say that with V2018 the hidden line cleanup works much better than it used to and in my experience it's the most useful result because without it I get thousands of artifacts from hidden geometry that should not be there.
As an example I've taken 3 screenshots of a section of a model I'm working on right now, the first being the actual 3D model in hidden line mode (what the result should look like), then a 2D projection without cleanup, lastly with cleanup.

The 2D projections both lose intersects between solids (and some other edges as well), both in about the same amount.
The cleanup option also tries to combine lines which is a disaster, so the first thing you need to do with the 2D projection is to select all & use the break line command. Layers are maintained which helps a little trying to repair it.

I wouldn't want you to wait 5 days, just to find you should've used the other setting. (which takes longer of course...)

Adrian

Dr PR

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Re: Large file
« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2018, 07:52:09 PM »
Adrian,

Thanks for the information.

The 3D to 2D conversion actually took "only" about 94.5 hours! The resultant file is 346 Mbytes. The resulting file is usable, but it is missing a lot of bits! Quite a bit of the small details is missing, and will have to be redone.

The result is very disappointing. I will have to repeat quite a bit of it.

Having to wait  3 1/2 days for each drawing to complete is a definite turn off!

Phil
DesignCAD user since 1987

adriank

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Re: Large file
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2018, 08:03:42 AM »
Phil,
You must have earned the trophy for the most patience with those kinds of delays!
I've been thinking that there may be other CAD programs out there that would do a better job of converting your 3D file to 2D? Could you export it to a DWG or a DXF, open in another program and save a 2D version to re-import into DCad?
I think that Sketchup Pro will save 2D vector files (as EPS files) but not the free version sadly.

Have you tried saving your 3D file as a Sketchup model, by the way? I'd be interested to see if Sketchup can cope with the size of it, what sort of job it does rendering it and how easy it is to rotate etc...

Adrian

Dr PR

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Re: Large file
« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2018, 01:43:25 PM »
Well, it finished a bit earlier than I expected - taking only 94 hours, just short of four days.

It will be a while before I start another of those jobs!

I haven't tried transferring the files to other programs. If it takes four days to convert a 3D files to a 2D files, how long will it take to convert to DXF or DWG? And will that be successful?

I have never used SketchUp. Who knows how long it would take to convert to a SketchUp files, and if the conversion would be successful? Then who knows if SketchUp can handle a file that big?

Anything you do with huge files will take a lot of time. It takes almost 90 minutes just to load a 350 Mbyte file and get the first Gouraud render (subsequent renders then take only about 15 seconds).

All of these what ifs and try this ideas could waste a lot of my time. This 350 Mbyte file is the largest of the files for the ship model, and I know DesignCAD will work with it. I would rather spend my time on something I know works rather than spinning my wheels on futile efforts.

This isn't the longest time I have had to wait for the computer to finish a task. Back in the '70s it took my home built 4 MHz Z80 machine about 8 days to compile a relational data base of the native plants of Oregon. That was before Uninterruptible Power Supplies (UPS) and when the local power sometimes went off and on like flashing Christmas lights. I think I succeeded in finishing the job only once!

Phil
DesignCAD user since 1987