Author Topic: Gravity snap failure  (Read 6043 times)

DrollTroll

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2015, 06:52:30 AM »
I have occasionally seen the "blue rectangle of not-snapping", but far too intermittently to troubleshoot. Picking any command from the command menu has always fixed it for me.

For Fillet Edge and Cut Edge, I always use Linesnap to snap to the edge-to-be-modified.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2015, 06:54:35 AM by DrollTroll »
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Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2015, 10:11:19 AM »
DT,

Thanks. But Linesnap didn't solve the problem for me. The command failed as before.

I had been using a 0.25 cut and the solid is 0.25 thick (along the edge to be cut). I thought maybe it was having a problem with a cut length equal to the part thickness so I tried a 0.125 cut and that also failed.

Phil
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drgroen

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #17 on: December 17, 2015, 05:17:08 AM »
Phil,

Have you tried 25.1?

We had a problem with Gravity Point snap/select/move on V25 64 bit and Win 10.
It sounds different from your problem, but V25.1 fixed it for us.

Dave

Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #18 on: December 17, 2015, 02:06:01 PM »
I am using DesignCAD 3D Max V25.1 dated 16-Oct-15.

I am a beta tester and this is the last version we tested. However I have wondered if the release version has this problem. I have looked around to try to be sure I have the last version DT released but I don't know what the date is on it.

What is the release version of V25.1 you are using?  Open the "Help/Aboout DesignCAD" menu item and look for the "Release Date."

Phil
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Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2016, 10:27:06 AM »
I have eliminated two potential causes of selection failure.

1. It is not drawing size. I have seen the problem on 3.4 Mbyte drawings.

2. It isn't caused by DesignCAD going into never-never land for a while. Right now I am working on a drawing and I cannot select anything!. However, I can open menus, rotate the view, etc. I can draw new objects, and the "Draw/Lines/Surface Intersection" works. But I can't select the new objects that I have just drawn.

All layers are unlocked. I opened the Layers dialog and clicked "Unlock All" several times.

Right click gravity snap moves the cursor to objects but nothing is selected.

The comma key gravity snap moves the cursor to objects but nothing is selected.

Left click with the cursor over objects will select nothing.

"Edit/Select All" selects nothing.

With the "Edit/Selection Filter" configured to select "Entity Type" and "Lines," "Circles," "Planes" or "Grid Surface" selected or "Select Solids Only" enabled nothing is selected in a drawing consisting of lines, circles, planes, grids and solids.

****

EDIT: Interesting! This is a drawing I have been working on for about seven years. I can select some objects that were drawn years ago with much earlier versions (whatever we were using in 2008). I can select objects that were added to the drawing yesterday with V25.1x64 (16-Oct-15). But I can't select objects that I was working on an hour ago. It is a 200 Mbyte drawing so I can't post it.

****

EDIT: I shut down DesignCAD, restarted it (V25.1x64) and reloaded the drawing. Now I can select things again. Something is causing the program to be confused about where the end of the drawing file is, as if it thinks the drawing file ends for searches before finding things that were created after the false end point. But I can still add things beyond the false end point.

This isn't a perfect solution because it takes about 10 minutes to render the 200 Mbyte drawing the first time with OpenGL/Gouraud shading. So now I have to go do something else while the program regenerates the shading information for the drawing I was working on a few minutes ago. Again, I really wish we had an option to save shading information with the drawing so we didn't have to waste so much time waiting for the drawing to shade after we reopen it to work on it again!

I'll continue watching for the thing that causes the program to stop searching before coming to the end of the drawing file.

Phil
« Last Edit: January 25, 2016, 11:36:48 AM by Dr PR »
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DrollTroll

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2016, 12:31:40 PM »
Is "Enable multi-layer editing" on in Layer Options? If not, that can cause unexpected oddities.
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Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2016, 12:50:14 PM »
DT,

I always work with multi-layer editing enabled. However, I haven't been checking if it has somehow become disabled. I keep a watch to see.

Phil
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Lar

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #22 on: January 26, 2016, 01:40:17 PM »
Phil, I have experienced your problem many times over the years but not that much to be an irritation, and so far have never pinned down the cause (...let me think... it may have something to do with right-clicking too soon after rolling the mouse wheel for scrolling).

If I right click twice and nothing gets selected then I left click and something will get selected, but the handle won't be where I want it. If not in point select mode I can then right click to re-select, so the big-blue handle goes where I snap. If in point select mode I would have to deselect then right-click (since right-clicking would pick up a point instead of selecting).

Lar

Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #23 on: January 26, 2016, 01:59:35 PM »
Lar,

I never use the "mouse wheel" - even thought the Kensington trackballs I use have the "wheel" circling the ball so I don't even have to stretch a finger to reach it. I guess I just grew up without the wheel and learned to live without it.

For a while I thought the problem might be caused by the program being hung up doing housekeeping after complex operations in large files. There are several things that do take an extraordinary long time in large drawings, such as opening the Info Box, undoing deletions and screen redraws. But this isn't the problem. When selection fails other functions work OK without a delay.

Still searching for the cause ...

Phil
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Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #24 on: January 27, 2016, 02:54:10 PM »
This time it happened immediately after I copy/pasted objects from another drawing. I had done this two times before and noticed no problem. The third time after I pasted the objects I used the "A+" button on the layers bar (as I had done the previous two times).

After that I couldn't left or right click select, either the newest objects or any old objects.

I immediately packed group IDs. No change. Then I packed solid IDs. No change.

Then I dragged a selection box around some of the objects I had just pasted into the drawing, and they were selected. After that left and right click started working again to select objects.

Usually it is only the left and right mouse buttons that fail to select objects. Drag selecting works, and that starts the mouse button selection working again.

Sometimes (rarely) all types of object selection fail. Then the only thing I have found that gets things working again is to shut down the program and restart. Maybe just closing the drawing and opening it again works - I'll try that the next time all selections fail.

This problem doesn't happen very often, but I can count on it at least once every six or eight hours of program time.

Phil
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Lar

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #25 on: January 27, 2016, 08:34:51 PM »
Usually it is only the left and right mouse buttons that fail to select objects.
Left always works for me. It's right that fails sometimes.

Lar

Dr PR

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2016, 10:11:04 PM »
Happened again.

I had just copy/pasted from another drawing. Then I selected the pasted object, changed layers with the "A+" button. Then I edited the object in Point Select Mode by selecting and dragging some of the points. After that I right click gravity snapped to select the object and moved it to a new position, then repositioned it again. So everything seemed to be working OK.

I saved the file.

Immediately after that left click, right click gravity snap, Comma key gravity snap, Period key gravity snap, selection box drag and "Select All" all failed to select anything. The gravity snap operations did move the cursor to the nearest point, but nothing was selected.

Then I drew a new line (V). I right clicked gravity snapped to the new line and it was selected. However, "Select All," gravity snap, left click would select only the new line and nothing else.

AHA!!!

I opened the Layers dialog and all the visible layers were marked unlocked (editable). Not long back I had used "Unlock All" to make all visible layers editable. I clicked "Unlock All" again and closed the Layers dialog.

Left click gravity snap, right click, drag selection box and "Select All" all worked again.

However, the Comma key gravity snap still did not work to select anything - the cursor does snap to the object but nothing is selected.

Whether "Unlock All" actually had anything to do with it remains to be seen. Sometimes it just starts working again after I do something.

****

The "Enable multi-layer editing" option is selected in the Layers dialog.

Phil
« Last Edit: January 30, 2016, 10:12:52 PM by Dr PR »
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DrollTroll

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2016, 06:33:42 AM »
The comma key is for Gravity Move -- it *just* moves the cursor to the nearest point -- it doesn't set a point, so naturally it doesn't select anything. The period key is for Gravity Snap -- it should set a point and select something (or set the next point if you're in a drawing command).
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Lar

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #28 on: February 01, 2016, 07:57:13 AM »
... I clicked "Unlock All" again and closed the Layers dialog.

Left click gravity snap, right click, drag selection box and "Select All" all worked again.
Phil, it seems like all your visible entities were multi-layered groups or solids and that the layers of some members of the groups/solids were off or uneditable.

'Unlock All' in the layer dialog is like a 'power up' that overrides the 'layer-off/uneditable-so-can't-be-selected' status and allows dcad to reach in and select things on off layers that are a part of groups and solids where some of the members are on visible layers. However, like all power ups it is only temporary and when its power is used up you have to click it again.

Nested group containers is a probable cause in situations like this but that doesn't seem to include v25.2

Lar

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Re: Gravity snap failure
« Reply #29 on: February 01, 2016, 10:24:32 AM »
Lar,

I avoid nested groups like the plague because of that unpredictable invisible container. Nested groups were disabled (always!). Furthermore, EVERY time I create a group I first select everything to be in the group and then use "Tools/Groups/Recursive Group Explode" to eliminate any possibility of a nested group. Then I use "Shift P" to re-select the parts and use "Tools/Groups/Group Define" to create the new group. I do this every time because I have found that sometimes the "disable nested groups" becomes disabled and cannot be trusted.

I guess I should create a macro to do all of this automatically when creating a group.


****

As far as some parts being on locked layers this is a possibility. But I am also paranoid about this. Occasionally the solid Boolean operations scatter parts of the resulting solid over multiple layers (usually putting some parts on layer zero). So after creating a solid I usually use the "A+" button in the Layer toolbar to ensure that all of the parts of the solid are on the same layer.

Again, I guess I should write a macro to do this automatically.

I don't know of any operations other than the solid Boolean functions that randomly move things from the layer they were on to another layer. So it is unlikely that is the cause of the selection failure.

And in the last instance that I reported it is impossible for that to be the problem. I put most objects in my library files on layer 1. When I copy/paste into a working file the active layer is always not layer 1 (I use layer 1 exclusively for reference lines for drawings). Immediately after pasting into a drawing I click the "A+" key in the Layers toolbox to move the pasted objects to the active layer.

Unless saving the file scattered parts to new layers (and I have never seen that happen) all parts of the pasted object should still have been on the layer where I put them. But I was unable to select the pasted object by any method.

****

I rarely want any layers to be locked. It is one of my pet peeves about DesignCAD that it comes up with non-visible layers locked. So I use "Unlock All" after opening a file to set things free. However, sometimes layers become locked - for reasons I don't always understand. So occasionally when I have the Layers dialog open I just click "Unlock All" out of habit.

Besides, I have been trying to select visible objects, and visible layers are unlocked unless you specifically lock them - which I rarely do.

So I don't think it is a problem caused by parts of objects being on locked layers. Anyway, often it is just lines, curves, arcs and circles that cannot be selected, and these are always on a single layer.

****

I really suspect that something is causing the search operation for selections to stop before it reaches the end of the drawing list. Most of the time it is only the most recently created objects that can't be selected. However, occaionally all visible objects cannot be selected by any means, so maybe sometimes it stops looking at or near the start of the list.

Sounds like an uninitialized variable or one that has been clobbered by another faulty operation.

Phil
DesignCAD user since 1987