Author Topic: designing/moving windows in a house  (Read 18168 times)

bobl

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designing/moving windows in a house
« on: June 18, 2014, 03:31:14 AM »
After 6 months "doing" I'm back in design mode (which is far more enjoyable) and need to draw the house (rough sketch with a mouse attached) to scale to get an idea of window postions and proportions...i.e. I'm going to change the apertures/windows.

I do need to model the floors 'cos the window bottoms must be <=1.1M above them.

Any advice re the best way (including recipes) to do this would be very gratefully received.
I can use 2000pro or 17.2 3D MAX.

Thank you in anticipation...it's good to have the opportunity to use designcad once more.

Edit...sorry about the sketch...I'm not much good with a mouse and my tablet driver's gone AWOL
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 03:34:31 AM by bobl »

prl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2014, 03:58:59 AM »
Your interested in modeling the spaces inside too (rooms) in relation to the openings (doors and windows)?  And compare and amend with exterior elevations for best size and placement?

Depending on the level of detail and accuracy, could be easy or a bear.  Do you have a dimensioned floor plan sketch for each level? A scanned pencil sketch?
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 04:07:43 AM by prl »

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2014, 09:06:35 AM »
Hi Pri

>Your interested in modeling the spaces inside too?
Absolutely and would have said so but had to go out as soon as I posted and was therefore strapped for time. We're talking double brick walls with a cavity in between so the internal measurements will be quite a bit smaller and therefore need to be taken into account.

>could be easy or a bear...
Probably a bear knowing my luck but looking on the bright-side that might improve my DCAD skills.

>Do you have a dimensioned floor plan
No but I need to do one and it'll be a bit easier now I've got the roof off <smile>
i.e. to get the wall thicknesses etc.
Thanks for the nudge...I'll work on that and come back.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2014, 09:14:41 AM by bobl »

Dr PR

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2014, 03:18:32 PM »
Bob,

Sounds like you want to make a drawing of an existing house, and you want to change the windows.

First, decide how much detail is necessary. If you just want to change windows you can draw each wall separately - no need to mess with floors, roof, foundation, etc.

But if you want to model the entire house you will have to take it in steps. In CAD you don't have to start at the ground and work up. You can start anywhere and add on new parts relative to what you have already drawn. However, I suspect most people start with the ground floor plan.

I have created CAD models for existing structures several times. The most important thing is to measure the dimensions accurately, and be consistent in how you do it. Always start with a reference point you can apply to all measurements, either directly, or relative to previous measurements. Try to avoid using a sequential series of measurements. Use direct measurements from the reference as much as possible because each measurement will have some small error, and sequential errors add up. Where necessary pick multiple reference points and measure the distances between them as accurately as you can.

For example, are interior heights measured from floor to ceiling? If so, are all floors at the same level? Carpets, tile and other floor coverings can influence measurements, and if you don't take them into consideration you will eventually run into problems making all the parts fit correctly.

Then draw each part one at a time. Usually each individual wall, window, etc. isn't very difficult.

Phil
DesignCAD user since 1987

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2014, 05:13:23 AM »
I still haven't had any time to do any measurements but that sounds like very good advice to bear in mind when I do....thanks for it

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2014, 11:45:17 AM »
at the moment I'm playing around with trying to draw the things I might need forgetting the precise measurements. First of all...thanks once again to all of you who responded to my last thread re my gable ladder...There's some great advice in there and it's really helping...that includes minstrel's site...fantastic!

I'm just going through that stuff now and have some questions
I really appreciate control keys and wonder....

Is there a key equivalent to left mouse click?
Edit: The best I could come up with is ___ ] ' 0,0,0 ___ in the point relative dialog so that all other points can be relative.
Edit ok getting there...I think i.e. ___ ] : ____   
Edit these two are not the same are they? i.e. I think : is some absolute postion and ' 0,0,0 is relative to last point if you check the box.   

I've drawn a box and want to put a gable roof on it i.e. an extruded equilateral triangle.
I followed minstrel's good advice re snap mid point and point relative to draw the mid-point of the triangle but struggle to extrude the triangle so that it hits the other end of the top of the house box dead level...Is there a control key way to do this and indeed a better way altogther.

Here's a more general one...Phil said dcad is different to every other cad package. I have access to sketchup, turbocad and viacad but haven't really used them to any great extent. I therefore don't appreciate in what way dcad differs and more specifically excels.

Over time companies tend to acquiesce to some norm re many things unless there is some showstopping design differences that preclude this. Can someone please give me the goods re dcad's unique gems both historically and now...e.g. I use a version of basic that has always been awesome for string-handling in both functionality and performance and I don't think anyone's really caught up even now.

Thanks in anticipation
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 12:47:43 PM by bobl »

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2014, 12:01:20 PM »
there's more
playing around I drew a free-hand shape to see where snap centre of gravity ended up and got this big cross thing with red squares at the intersection....LOL...whatssssssssss that!!!

Edited...Oh I see it lets me stretch things in 2-D or re-orient things....Cool!
Ahhh found it....I must have key'd the 'using resize handles' button on

Also if I hit space I get a command prompt up and after I close it I get a 3-D point that I don't seem able to delete....how is this done please.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 12:18:25 PM by bobl »

Rob S

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2014, 08:15:06 PM »
I may be able to help with acouple of these questions

Key equivalent for left mouse would be the "ins" key, it sets a point at the current cursor position, conversely the period key is equal to right-mouse click, its sets a point on top of the nearest existing point in the drawing, comma moves the cursor to the nearest point without setting a new point, all have their uses!!

To extrude your triangle along the top of your box, select the triangle by one of its base corners - (left-click near the corner), then from the menu "draw, extrude", then set points using right-mouse or period on the corresponding front and rear corners of the box, and hit enter, and bob's your uncle, I mean there's your roof.

As far as I'm concerned, and quoting from several previous posts by myself, Designcad's greatest feature is you just open the program and start drawing, no setup required.  The right-click snap to existing is close behind. 

The thing about computer drawing is, I think it's always best to draw exactly to true size from the start, you need to enter some kind of dimension for everything, it may as well be the correct one.  That way, you can see right away if something works and if it will look right, because it looks exactly as it will in the real thing.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2014, 08:21:15 PM by Rob S »
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bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2014, 12:54:00 AM »
Rob
That's exactly the advice I was looking for...

Your view that "right click snap to existing" is right up there doesn't surprise me at all but I don't seem to have the hang of it yet.

On a related note...I'm still struggling to get the roof alignment right.
I realise it's me and not designcad but I'm not sure whether the mis-alignment is 'cos I'm not snapping the triangle to the box right or that my two right clicks are out
i.e. is there a fool-proof way to snap to everything.
i.e. I seem to be able to snap and to draw lines but struggle to mix the two...
particularly when it comes to specifying the end of the line
i.e. as if I'm missing something
BTW just before checking here...I'd snapped to a box's mid-point...and used point relative to draw a horizontal line. Is there a way to snap that line precisely to the y-line at the other end of the box.

Thank you very much for your advice

BTW re "it's always best to draw exactly to true size from the start"
I couldn't agree more and as soon as I've got those dimensions I'll be doing just that
thanks to your explanation re point relative etc.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 01:10:39 AM by bobl »

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2014, 02:01:01 AM »
ok...re a line across the middle of a box...playing around...I've worked out that right-click "likes" corners when line drawing. So I...
1 started at the "to" end of the line (as opposed to "from")
2 snapped to the mid-point of the box's "to" y-line
3 drew a diagonal line to the box's from y-line which snapped with right-click to the box's bottom corner (I did this just to retain a point on the box's to y-line's midpoint)
4 moved to the box's from y-line
5 snapped to it's mid-point
6 selected line drawing tool
7 clicked on the blue midpoint dot
8 drew the line across close to the start of the diagonal line where it intersects the box's to line's mid-point and right-clicked to snap on to the box's to y-line's intersection with the diagonal line i.e. the y-lines mid-point and it worked.
Is there an easier way...I'm guessing yes <smile> 
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 02:04:10 AM by bobl »

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2014, 02:14:05 AM »
It seemed quite easy once you've got just one "to" point to draw lines around the box
i.e. by snapping to each y-lines midpoint and drawing a line from it to your existing line (which starts with that single point).
I tried to test that I was hitting the mid-points (I think I did snap the dimension lines) but the two dimensions aren't the same?
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 02:18:56 AM by bobl »

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2014, 02:29:18 AM »
Not quite a representation of my roof but...close and I think my practicing Rob's advice re snapping/right-clicking has more or less solved my triangle-box alignment difficulty. As you can see I managed to stretch the roof from side to side but front to back handles don't seem to "work"....dcad2000pro.

Will try later in 17.2
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 02:32:03 AM by bobl »

bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2014, 03:01:52 AM »
re the line around the mid-point of a box...i just drew two boxes half the height and moved one on to the other using snap and the dimensions come out perfectly.

Rob S

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2014, 09:01:14 AM »
right, you are definitely getting the hang of it.

A couple of other commands you might find useful are:

Linesnap "K" puts a point on the nearest location on the nearest line to the cursor.

The ortho command "H" causes the cursor to move in a horizontal or vertical direction, so you can draw freehan lines yet still parallel to the walls.

In terms of drawing your house, you might try to think in terms of drawing flat boxes, ie a box for the floor giving you a baseplate to build on,  and then place flat vertical boxes on top for the walls.

Then, you can punch holes in those wall boxes for the windows, using solid subtract.
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bobl

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Re: designing/moving windows in a house
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2014, 01:04:17 PM »
K and H sound just the job as does using flat boxes.
I'll let you know how I get on and thanks very much indeed for your advice.
I'm really enjoying using designcad!

Edit...Just came back to say k and h are amazing. Obviously I'm not using them with any familiarity but their value re productivity is obvious after just a couple of minutes playing with them.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 01:23:03 PM by bobl »